SC in ProTools 7

[nordhound]

I've installed SC in ProTools 7 on a Mac G4 dual 1.42...

A suggestion: Can you talk us PT users through the routing setup? The current documentation provided refers to other platforms. In particular, routing back from WB does not present the same options as those listed for Logic [for instance].

Also,

I am having trouble getting the multis to sound. Individual non-WB presets work fine.

[Sam Fischmann]

Here are step-by-step instructions for PT 6. For 7, it should be very similar, but all of the MIDI options have moved into the Setup menu.

If you're using Windows XP:

Download and install MIDI Yoke
Restart

On Both Windows and OS X:
Open WordBuilder
On the voice setup screen, select Tenors
MIDI in should be set to Virtual WordBuilder 1(Mac) or MIDI Yoke 1 (PC)
MIDI out should be set to Virtual Wordbuilder 2(Mac) or MIDI Yoke 2 (PC)
Click OK
Type a word into WordBuilder

Start Pro Tools
Create a new session
Under the MIDI menu, choose Input Filter
Select Record All
Choose OK
(Mac only) Under the MIDI menu, choose Input Devices
(Mac only) Check all the Virtual WordBuilder Ports and click ok

Create a stereo Aux Track
Load Symphonic Choirs as an insert in the Aux Track
Load a Tenors WB Multi from the NEW MULTI menu

Create a MIDI track
Name the MIDI track WordBuilder
Set the MIDI in to your keyboard input
Set the MIDI out to Virtual WordBuilder 1 (Mac) MIDI or Yoke 1 (PC)
Set the Channel to 1

Create 5 more MIDI tracks
Name them Choirs1 - Choirs5, respectively
Set the MIDI in to Virtual WordBuilder 2 (Mac) or MIDI Yoke 2 (PC). The channel should match the track name.
Set the MIDI out to the Symphonic Choirs plugin. The channel should match the track name.
Hold shift and click on the record enable buttons for all MIDI tracks

[Muso]

Hi Nordhound,
I'm using SC in 6.9.3 I can't get a full SATB to work in PT. It overloads the CPU.
But if I just pull up 2 at a time and then record to an Audio track it works great.
Tell me if you get it up and working in PT 7. Also you can refer to my previous logs to get more info on using SC in PT.


All the best,
Mitch

[nordhound]

I've been in discussion with Sam about PT 7 and at this point I'm convinced SC won't run in PT 7. I've followed the template exactly and get consistent kernel crashes. Perhaps it's a midi routing issue, but not from the user's standpoint. Sam, have you had any success in PT7 yet?

[Sam Fischmann]

Hi Guys,

I'm still working on this and will post new instructions as soon as I can find something that works well. I'm surprised that the setup doesn't work for 7; there must be a setting somewhere causing problems.

-Sam

[Sam Fischmann]

Choirs and WordBuilder work in Pro Tools 7 with some minor changes to the above method. Attached is a project that loads a test with the Tenors.

Please open the WordBuilder choir file first, then the Pro Tools session, record enable the four MIDI tracks, and press play. I'd like to see how it works for others before adding it to the FAQ, but it works for me and at least one other Pro Tools 7 Mac user.

On the instrument track, you can see that the input is set to Virtual WordBuilder 4. This is a dummy setting, just to make sure it doesn't revert to 'all' as soon as you open the project. You may change this to the input of your MIDI keyboard, but NEVER EVER set the MIDI input to 'all.'

-Sam

[guitaro]

Sam,

Thank you, thank you for working on this! I just got SC and was quite disturbed that it consistently crashed Pro Tools 7. I was just about to write a post when I saw your fix, and must say that it’s a really close solution.

When you say “record enable the four midi tracks” I think you mean 5 right? I assume the consonants are on 5. Well, I did and can hear some consonants, but they very, very light, have to boost the velocity to +30 to hear them. A few times the midi 5 track got stuck where the fader level remains on even when I stop the play. Not sure what that’s about.

Also, when I enter consecutive notes on the grid like a melody in quarter notes (tick mode not sample mode), it will only play back the first note and skips the rest. If I decrease the duration to eight notes with an eighth rest , they play fine, as long as there is a space between them on the grid. Now, I know there are some really whacky things with PT7 and midi, but the same worked fine when I tried SC in standalone mode on a PC with lightpipe fed into the Mac.

Can you check on those things please?

Thanks,

GM

Mac Dual 2.7 G5
OSX 10.4.3
2.5 GB Ram

[Sam Fischmann]

Hello,

Thanks for being a guinea pig with PT7! First, I loaded a small quiet patch for the test, so that people with RAM limitations shouldn't have as much of a problem. Second, I did mean 5 MIDI tracks, sorry for the typo :D

About the notes aligned on a grid...I ran an empty Pro Tools session (with just one MIDI track) through a MIDI probe and found a disturbing thing... if you line up notes exactly next to one another, it only sends note offs for everything but the first note! If you shift them a little bit left or right, or even overlap them, it starts sending note-on messages again.

Unfortunately, WordBuilder will never know to make sound unless Pro Tools sends note ons! We'll see what Digi has to say...

-Sam

[guitaro]

Sam,

That would sure seem to explain why it only played the first note of the melody line on my test, unless there was a space between the notes. But when I tested SC and WB as a standalone (on a PC using RME Digiface with lightpipe out to Pro Tools Mac), using the same type of melody lines with midi notes next to each other, it seemed to work fine. I’ll test that more tonight though.

If you have any inside track with Digi, we’d sure appreciate the help on that one.

Thanks again for looking into this Sam!

Robert

[guitaro]

Sam,

I did quite a bit of testing tonight and came to the same conclusion as nordhound…SC with WB just does not work in Pro Tools 7.

I have a standalone PC (Asus P5LD2, 2GB, Pentium D 3GHz, RME Digiface Soundcard 24 lightpipe outs) that I use for Giga, VOTA and Nuno’s Vota Utility that feeds into Pro Tools on a Mac G5 (Dual 2.7, 2.5GB). I created a similar setup with SC and WB as a standalone version on the PC feeding into Pro Tools on the Mac. I created a melody with midi notes next to each other and it played and sung the words fine.

I took the same melody and placed it on an instrument track with SC as an RTAS (without WB) using a standard OO sample, not a WB multi. It also played the melody and sung the OO’s fine.

I then took the same melody and placed it on the instrument track that you created for your test session, and followed the new procedure you outlined exactly. Again, it only played the first note, skipped most of the notes, and managed to play one another note towards the end. Further, in one of the documents it stated that WB is setup properly if you see the in/out midi icons light up. During this test that did not happen. I believe that it is probably Wordbuilder that does not work with Pro Tools 7, not necessarily SC itself.

I must say that this is very disappointing. I truly hope EW can get this to work. To utilize this as an RTAS on the Mac was the primary reason I went with SC.

Thanks Sam!

Robert

[Sam Fischmann]

Hello Robert,

WordBuilder and Choirs DO work with Pro Tools 7. The notes not playing after the first is an issue particular to Pro Tools and interapplication MIDI, not Choirs or WordBuilder (in other words, Pro Tools will behave this way with any program hooked up through IAC). If your notes don't line up on the grid, this isn't an issue anyway. For some reason or another, this doesn't seem to happen with physical MIDI ports or installed drivers, just virtual, application generated ports (like those in WordBuilder, Max/MSP, Digital Performer, and the IAC bus). It is an option to hook up a real loopback cable from one MIDI port to another if you have extra room on your MIDI interface, and it should work just like your external setup (though this I haven't tested because I'm not at work right now).

That being said, it requires some tampering and is more difficult than other sequencers. One issue is that even if you use my project, you still need to go to MIDI-Input devices and enable the WordBuilder ports, and check the MIDI filter settings as in my instructions at the top of the thread.

One more issue is that if you're having trouble bouncing, you probably want to quit wordbuilder and then take all the MIDI tracks off of record, in that order.

-Sam