A Mixing breakthrough of sorts

[ToddK]

Well, i had an idea for a mixing study.
I decided to try to duplicate a CD mix.
I chose FooFighters "Home next Year".
Pretty straight forward, and has a great
rock drum sound.
So i re-recorded all the instruments for 30 seconds of this song as i A/B compared the original Foofighters mix, vs my own mix.

Basically, trying to sonically match it as best
i can, using DKFH Superior w/Custom n Vintage
and other stuff i'll list below.

Stuff i used for this=

DW1 kick drum
Ludwig 1 acrolite 66 snare
14" sabian 1 hi hat
12" Sonar maple RT 2
14" Sonar maply RT3
18" Sabian stage crash
18" Vintage Zildian crash

I dont use bounce. I do everything real time
in Nuendo. ( i have plenty of ram)
I dont use the bleed functions really.
I do, but only within the "overhead" and "ambience".
In the "overhead" i have mostly cymbals dominating, with
hats, kick,snare, and toms down quite a bit.
I sub the overheads to a subgroup, and compress
it just a bit, with PSP Mixpressor. Using heavy
EQ with Waves paragraphics. Cutting alot of mids
and mid lows. I get as much snare in the overheads
as i can with out to much midrange, cause the overhead
gives the snare openness and air.

I have the ambience enabled for kick snare and toms.
I sub the ambience channels to a subgroup,
and compress it a bit heavier this time, also using
some pretty extreme EQ. Mostly getting rid of
mid lows. 250 to 450 Mostly just want to get
more room/air, not so much mid or low punch.

Then i subgroup the close mic'd stuff = Kick snare hats,
I compress and tape saturate this subgroup using
PSP Mixpressor and Mixsaturator using a bit of the
"Warmth" knob at around 100.
For those that havent expierienced the PSP "Warmth"
knob, oooohhh, you need to get you some o dat. mmmm yummy.
On Kick and Snare close channels, im again EQing, mostly going for
cutting 200 to 500 range.
Through all this EQ'ing, 99% of it is cutting, no boosting.
And i never push any faders past Odb.
I use the UAD-1 1176 LN limiter for Snare and Kick
treatment/compression. IT kicks.
Also using the gate function in superior
to tighten the kick snare and toms.
Ive got waves and psp all over the place.
Using Trilogy for bass, with Waves Renesiance bass and Renasaince compressor.
Tamborine for Stylus RMX and String pad is from Atmosphere.
Fender Telecaster and Pod V2

What ive found from doing this(trying to match
output level with the Foo song from the getgo),
was i got the results i was looking
for by mixing, while having
my mastering plugs going on the master bus.
I use C4, PSP Vintage Warmer, and Waves L2
on the master bus, in that order. Using each fairly
minimaly.
WOW, this works REALLY well. I realize how crazy
it is, when i bypass everything on the masterbus.
IT sounds like total crap. Wild... But it works.

This is a major breakthrough for me actually.
Recording while A/Bing the whole time and really
paying attention to things, really pays off.
I found i was mostly going wrong in the 200 to 500 range.
Cutting most of this out of the Drums/Bass/and guitars
does wonders.

http://michaelk101.com/todd/toddmp3/foocopynew.wav

Love to hear what you think of this.
TK

[sinkd]

nice. great tips

I am also a big fan of PSP VW.

DS

[wilx]

Nice work, and really interesting, detailed post.

I'm fairly new to the mixing/production side of things, and it really is a minefield!
I'm trying to get round EXACTLY what each bit of a compressor does, and the differences between each, the same with eq/limiters etc.

I think I'll spend a day with Logic and the lovely manual when I have the time!
A step-by-step video tutorial on mixing a pop song, a rock song, an acoustic song and a small instrumental ensemble from step 1 to the master mix would be ideal.

Sounds great by the way.

[doug hazelrigg]

What you're trying to do is not an illegitimate way to learn how to mix, however:

>that Foo album has been roundly criticized by audiophiles because it's another "Loudness Wars" entry, IOW, it's been mastered with WAY too much level... so what you're attempting is really trying to approximate the mastering on the recording. That's really a seperate issue from the mix... although that line IS blurring anymore

>for my money your drums are loud but maybe have too much top end

>the typical rock mix should leave at least a couple db's of room in case the ME needs them

[ToddK]

Yes, this mix is not realistic in that, it has no vocal.

Having a vocal sit on top, i would have to change some things obviously.
Mainly just trying to get it bright, without boosting treble.

I choose not to enter the volume wars, but my clients do, so i have
to do the best i can to give them bright, loud mixes.

Mixing with the mastering plugs running is the best way i can
do that at the moment, so im running with it. :)

[Joseph Hanna]

Todd,

I love it! Not so much the recording (although it's fine) but the willingness to experiment. It is that gumption, in the end, that will make you a better engineer. It's also cool you decided to share.

Personally I get tired of the endless conversations about how the lastest pre-amp/compressor/converter/ purchase will make my projects sound better.

Making use of the tools "at hand" and the talent at hand is a worthy investment in and of itself.

Thanks...