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View Full Version : The sound of my new orchestral template


SJK
05-23-2012, 05:36 AM
It's time to finally post something I did. It's a mood piece and was basically a test for my new template. But I kind of like it, so here it is:

Rising Force on Soundcloud (http://soundcloud.com/sung-kyu/rising-force)

Feedback is very welcome :)

Dean
05-23-2012, 09:31 AM
It's time to finally post something I did. It's a mood piece and was basically a test for my new template. But I kind of like it, so here it is:

Rising Force on Soundcloud (http://soundcloud.com/sung-kyu/rising-force)

Feedback is very welcome :)

Hey Sjk,

Im not sure this template is working just yet.

The brass sounds very centred and too dominant and has little seperation,space,presence between Tubas,TBNS,F.HNs etc.

The percussion sounds too thin and very far away and unbalanced.In your cue the perc hits are very far right and not balanced on the left,it would sound great with some huge ambient hits to the left doubling the higher perc to the left.

Also there seems to be some timing issues with the percussion hits,sounds like the start of the perc hits is late and the perc that comes in at 1:20 doesnt have any presence or body,the perc sounds very thin and weak and too low in the mix.

D

TGV
05-23-2012, 12:14 PM
Some more points:
- the string ostinato sounds weak in comparison to the strings of the first seconds
- at 0:50 - 1:00 there is very much bass, which pushes almost everything away
- the ending has a lot of volume, but not that much impact
- I had the feeling the crescendo was mainly done with volume, and not with "expression", since the character of the sound hardly changes during the crescendo
Hope this can help you a bit.

SJK
05-24-2012, 01:14 AM
Thanks a lot for the feedback!

The center heavy brass is a given, since I put some modeled brass in the center for the surround mix, and they didn't get panned for the stereo mixdown. I'll have to look into that.

I agree 100% with the comment on impact, the whole things doesn't have enough punch to my ears. It might be a combination of the percussion and expression.

It sounded a lot punchier before I added the far mics to the surround channels (as far as the stereo mix goes). Maybe I need to drop them for the stereo mix.

It's funny how experienced stereo mixers stay away from surround, because of all the additional implications it brings. But when it comes to space and dynamics, surround is much easier IMHO.

boxc
05-24-2012, 03:18 AM
I agree with the others that the percussion is a bit weak and sounds a bit artificial. Avoid using the same sample twice with the exact same velocity! The ending is unnecessary long and repetitive.

I like the piece though, especially the staccato strings in the background, soft and tense-building. The chord progressiosn and harmonies are also nice and I actually don't have so much problem with the brass, I like it. Although that may say more about my sense for mixing than it does for your song hehe.

I also want to add that I think TGV is a great commenter. Always has intelligent and constructive things to say.

SJK
05-24-2012, 03:44 AM
I agree with the others that the percussion is a bit weak and sounds a bit artificial. Avoid using the same sample twice with the exact same velocity!

I think a lot of the weakness has to do with too much signal from the surround mics. As for the velocity, I prefer to play rhythms by hand, so I'll get a MPD pad soon.


The ending is unnecessary long and repetitive.

I agree, I wanted to add some more things in the build-up, but I ran out of time (needed to put something up for somebody to hear).


I like the piece though, especially the staccato strings in the background, soft and tense-building. The chord progressiosn and harmonies are also nice and I actually don't have so much problem with the brass, I like it. Although that may say more about my sense for mixing than it does for your song hehe.

I also want to add that I think TGV is a great commenter. Always has intelligent and constructive things to say.

Yes, so far the things I've read from TGV are very constructive and well informed.

Thanks a lot for your comment :)

SJK
05-31-2012, 01:35 AM
OK, I replaced the original file with an updated version. I tried to address some of the constructive inputs, but of course there's a lot more I could do.

Just as a side note, I do this as a hobby alongside my 9to5 job, family and our Taijiquan school. So I get to spend around 5-10 hours a week in my studio. With that said, I want to move on and work on something else, so this is as far as I want to take it. Besides, it sounds better (good enough for now) in surround :p

Thanks for listening :)

TGV
05-31-2012, 03:01 PM
I think it sounds better, although it's hard to compare by memory. It's still not at the level some of the pros on this forum reach, but you probably knew that. There seems to be a more space for the individual parts, and the percussion has more body. I still think the bass is rather heavy at some points, but it is less static, less monotonous. I think it is a good idea to leave this work as it is, and start on something else. That will give you a new perspective.

BTW, I'm just an amateur with a normal working week and a family too. Many people here are. But some are a few steps further. Listen to their tracks (and to good movie tracks,and well recorded acoustical music), and try to analyze them. Read books or magazines about sound engineering. Then apply this knowledge to your next work. It helped me, I think (at least, I think my later stuff sounds a lot better than older work).

Good luck, and enjoy!!

SJK
06-01-2012, 01:18 AM
It's still not at the level some of the pros on this forum reach, but you probably knew that.

I sure do! It's an act of balance to be constantly able to compare your work with the work of other, more experienced users and even working pros and not lose yourself doing it.

For my first finished orchestral track, I think it's not that bad :)

Time to move on.


BTW, I'm just an amateur with a normal working week and a family too. Many people here are. But some are a few steps further. Listen to their tracks (and to good movie tracks,and well recorded acoustical music), and try to analyze them. Read books or magazines about sound engineering. Then apply this knowledge to your next work. It helped me, I think (at least, I think my later stuff sounds a lot better than older work).

Good luck, and enjoy!!

It's always encouraging to read about other people who don't have all the time in world and still get things done. Thanks for your comments :)

By the way, can you send me a link to some of your stuff?

TGV
06-01-2012, 04:34 AM
Sure, you can listen to it at http://soundcloud.com/tgv or even see one or two things at http://youtube.com/ElTGV

christerholm
06-01-2012, 04:38 AM
I think it sounds great, powerful and epic! But I am not a pro, haha. So I don't hear anything wrong with it.

Reminds me I should probably also make a template. Always just work on a track by track basis, it can be a bit limiting for the creative mood sometimes, starting to look for certain instruments / articulations as you are making the track.

SJK
06-01-2012, 05:13 AM
I think it sounds great, powerful and epic! But I am not a pro, haha. So I don't hear anything wrong with it.

Thanks :)


Reminds me I should probably also make a template. Always just work on a track by track basis, it can be a bit limiting for the creative mood sometimes, starting to look for certain instruments / articulations as you are making the track.

I can only recommend it. You could also just start with a track you finished, so you don't have to set up the reverbs and all the routing, but I like to start from scratch when I begin a piece. But you know, it's the finishing a track I am struggling more with :D

SJK
06-03-2012, 02:38 PM
I know, I said I'd move on, but there were still too many things I didn't like, so I spent 4 more hours on it.

I'm pretty happy with how it sounds in surround now, so even though there could be a lot more done for the stereo version, I'll really leave it as it is now.

Rising Force final version (http://soundcloud.com/sung-kyu/rising-force)

Thanks for listening and thanks for all the comments :)

jspencer
06-03-2012, 09:45 PM
Hey SJK, you are like me (and I'm sure most of us). When it comes to writing personal music, it's never good enough and we are never 100% happy with it.....there is ALWAYS room to improve. However, it's all part of the big picture. You'll be glad you experimented when you get the next music job.

SJK
06-04-2012, 12:19 AM
Very true. That's one of the reasons why I constantly procrastinated to even start to finish anything; I never thought it was good enough. But (with some outside help) I changed my expectations from the perfectionist who doesn't get anything done to finishing what I start and make it as perfect as I can. It sounds easy once you're on that track, but for some (like me) getting on it isn't.

Anyway, I love making music and finally getting some things out for other people to listen to is a big step for me and feels very good :)

Cheers!