Noob needs direction

[theonlynamenottaken]

I'm a 32 year old amateur musician. I play guitar, keyboard and generally have a good understanding of theory.

I have wanted to play with writing symphonic/orchestral music for a while. I essentially want to plug up my guitar or keyboard to my PC, play melodies, watch them appear on the screen (in the timing I played them), then arrange them and apply violin, oboe, sitar, etc, etc.

My grasp of all this is laughable. I have no idea where to start.

What do I need?
- DAW
- VST package like Garritan, Halion, EWQL?
- Special audio hardware?
- A giant hard drive?
- How do I get MIDI into my PC? A card?

I am a PC guy (Windows 7 and Ubuntu dual-boot), but don't let the hardware side influence your advice - if I need to buy a totally separate, dedicated PC for this I will...

I realize this is analogous to me asking a bunch of Formula 1 drivers "Duh, how do I drive a car?" I'm not going to be doing this as a career - I just want to get the ideas I have in my head into an mp3/wav/etc that I can hear. I'm also not asking for specific brand names as much as I'm asking for general setup advice... Thanks in advance for stooping to my level

Also, any books you might recommend that would enlighten such a lost noob?

[chest]

For some of the technical aspects (DAW, MIDI, audio interfaces, etc), you could start by reading here: http://www.tweakheadz.com/

Re sample libraries, people here will recommend those by EW - partly because this forum belongs to EW, but also because EWQLSO is a lot better than GPO (which you mentioned).

Yes, you might, as you suggest, need to get a dedicated PC - actually, perhaps with more than one drive specifically for samples, because a single drive can be a bottleneck for sample streaming. (Some people use several PCs.)

But if you don't want to rush headlong into a lot of spending (in case you change your mind about what you want to do) perhaps you could start by using the PC you've got til you're sure you want to commit to buying another. Might be a good idea, though, to extend your dual-boot set up, by adding another partition just for trying out music/audio software. I suppose you could make do with your PC's (I presume) basic sound card for a while, and you could start by using Reaper (low-cost DAW, with a generous free-trial period). If your (music) keyboard has USB connections, perhaps you could plug that into a USB socket on your existing PC, but if it has a MIDI out, you could (for initial trials) buy a very cheap cable with a MIDI socket on one end and a USB plug on the other. For the sake of setting up and testing, you might be able to use free VST instruments (eg software synths) rather than buy rather expensive sample libraries on day 1.

Do take care about what you buy and in what order - you could spend a surprising amount of money on all the hardware, software, sample libraries, etc, so be careful not to rush into a lot of spending, all at once, til you're sure you know where you're heading. (And look out for EW sales/promotions.) Also, if you buy too much stuff at once, by the time you've got familiar with half of it, the other half might have been superseded by later versions or be available at a lower price.

If/when you've got one or more EW sample libraries, you'll find a lot of help available on this forum, though, til then, don't expect to get an awful lot more than some ordinary good-neighbourly advice.

[erikreid]

Welcome to the madness,

First off, do not be afraid to ask question. We are all here to help each other out.

Now let’s see, all this depends on how much money do you have to spend. You could have plenty and go full out with a new rig and a whole set up. You could have a really tight budget and can’t really get a whole lot. Let’s start you off with the tight budget. First off, if you are looking to input into the computer via keyboard or guitar, I recommend that you do get a DAW. I myself have a Mac setup and use logic. I was a PC user before and used Sonar, which is very good. Most DAWs have the same basic functions, the difference is the workflow and of course the onesy and twosy features that are specific to the company that makes the DAW. I would research each one and see what fits your needs. The main ones that I see that are being used is Sonar by cakewalk (PC), Cubase by Steinberg (PC, Mac) and Logic by Apple (Mac). I put what platform each one can do because if you like say logic, then you have to get a Mac. Research each one and see what fits. Now with the Virtural Instruments package type thing that you asked, it is good to have some. Starting off though, the DAWs come with Virtural Instruments that you can use. If you want to go even further in terms of expanding your sound pallet, you should do some research on each of the companies you mentioned and see what works for you. Just about every Virtural Instrument producer has demo to show case their VI's. Listen to the demos and choose what works for you. In terms of "Special" audio hardware, again research, (if you have not noticed, there is allot of research to be done with this) but if you are on a budget, the sound card you have in your computer will work, if not, I would recommend M-audio cards, not to bad and not too expensive. The more VIs and programs you get, the more hard drive space you will need. You could get one giant hard drive, but I discourage against it. First off, if you stream your audio/ VI samples from the hard drive, and you have everything on one drive, you will have latency issues and possibly crash the hard drive. In my set up, I have the DAW software and VI extension on the main hard drive and all of my samples are spread across 4 hard drives. I have 500 GBs hard drives because anything more than that is a waste of money and space. NEVER, I repeat, NEVER have your samples on the same drive as your OS. First off, it will DRASTICALLY slow your system and will cause it to crash, second, if you crash it, you won’t have to reinstall the sample libraries, and with the size of them these days, it takes a loooong time to install them. It took me 2 days for symphonic library platinum, and almost a week for Quantum Leap Pianos. Now how you can get midi into your computer is fairly easy these days, you can either get a midi port that connects to you computer via USB or you can get a midi controller that connects via USB. I use m-audio because set up is easy and just about everything recognizes them, and the cost is fairly low for decent quality controllers. I have many systems in the house. But I do have an iMac and a PC networked together and these systems are ONLY used for music. I recommend having a dedicated system for music not connected to the internet. Granted, my Mac is connected to the net, but the PC is not and any updates I can download and dump into the share drive. It would suck to catch a virus and mess up your system and all of your creative work going down the drain, it’s not fun. If you decide to run with doing music, you will find out that have multiple systems has its benefits, but that is another topic. Now, I am sure everyone here will agree, "The guide to midi orchestration" is probably the best book you can get for this. It breaks everything down so that a noob like us can learn and pros like these other guys will get something out of it. The book is expensive, but it is sooo worth it, that you will have it for a loong time. I know this is allot of information and your eyes are probably bleeding from reading the Wall-O-Text, but hopefully this will get you started and I am sure everyone here will provide more information. Good luck, have fun, and see you around the forums.

[MoshUntilPanic]

gonna get shot down in flames here but...

Pro-tools - best at recording, crap at MIDI
Cubase - best at MIDI, recording pretty good
Logic - ok at both, best at neither
Other DAWS - dont bother :P

i strongly suggest cubase for what you plan to do - cubase 5 studio. it sounds like you arent planning to tax your pc too much so i wouldnt worry getting a giant hard drive - for example, east west orchestra gold is only 33 gigs, silver even less at 11

i would then suggest a midi keyboard, can connect to your PC through usb, and then a simple guitar interface (i just bought the line 6 POD studio gx, and think its amazing quality for only 60/70 quid, and comes with plenty of virtual amps and pedals).

theres without doubt fancy audio interfaces you could buy, but for what you seem to want to use it for, i wouldn't spend thousands on unnecessary hardware.

[halftone]

Hi,

Chest gives a really good suggestion by pointing you towards Tweakheads.

Other than that I would say to take time with your decisions.

It seems you have a lot of experience with music and probably have a good idea that this is something you wish to do and spend money on.

Don't spend small. Eventually you will want good VST instruments and equipment anyway.

I started by purchasing less expensive libraries that just didn't make it when they were compared to East West or Spectrasonics products.

Assuming that your current PC specs will manage and that your keyboard is midi capable then all you should need to start is an audio interface, and DAW software such as Sonar or Cubase.

Usually DAW software comes with some instruments that you can use to start becoming familiar with recording quickly.

You can think about better libraries while learning the ABC's of midi.

Good speakers are quite important as well. I could not believe the difference in sound when I bought near field monitors. It really helped me to improve my mixes.

Good luck with your decisions.

regards John

[A.M.P.]

"I essentially want to plug up my guitar or keyboard to my PC, play melodies, watch them appear on the screen (in the timing I played them), then arrange them and apply violin, oboe, sitar, etc, etc."

Doing this with a keyboard is extremely easy since it has midi outs. If you wanted to play a melody/chords/whatever on guitar and then change it to something else you would need to install a midi pickup for the guitar. The only one I know of is made by roland, it's the gk3 or something.

[theonlynamenottaken]

I ran across this site last week while researching DAWs. I posted here because everyone seemed so friendly and knowledgeable - thanks for proving me right. Your advice was exactly what I was looking for. I think I've got a good roadmap of what decisions I need to make and what I should buy and learn. I'll come back one day when I can rub elbows with you...